STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:
People watching this summit from afar include Representative John Moolenaar, who is a Republican member of Congress from Michigan and chairman of the House Select Committee on China. He joins us from Washington, D.C. Mr. Chairman, welcome back.
JOHN MOOLENAAR: Well, good morning. Good to be with you this morning.
INSKEEP: What is your best-case scenario for an outcome here?
MOOLENAAR: Well, I think, first of all, we need to build trust with China, and that comes from seeing and measuring how they did on previous agreements. Have they lived up to those agreements, and how can we make sure that whatever comes out of this meeting is something that sticks and is enforceable? We want to see some agricultural products that were promised to be purchased last time, make sure our workers in America are treated fairly. You know, I think China could be helpful opening up the Strait of Hormuz and making sure that Iran does not get a nuclear weapon.
There are a lot of things that could come out of this, but I think this initial meeting that is happening today will be important to start to lay the groundwork on what actually is achievable, and how can we be confident that China will actually do what they say they're going to do?
INSKEEP: Which I think you have not been very confident in in the past, and that leads to my next question. As a skeptic of China, do you also have a worst-case scenario that the president of the United States might promise too much?
MOOLENAAR: Well, we have to remember we're dealing with the Chinese Communist Party. We love the Chinese people, but the Chinese Communist Party has been, you know, a major oppressor of people around the world, including in their own country, with slave labor, threatening their neighbors and allies of the United States, continuing to, you know, steal technology and use those for dual-use military and commercial capabilities. So my hope is that the president will have the opportunity to talk about opening up markets in China but recognize we don't want to sell them our best technologies that could be used by their military against our men and women in the armed forces.
INSKEEP: So I wonder what you thought when the group of CEOs going with President Trump got a little larger. The CEO of Nvidia, which makes AI chips - the finest AI chips, designs them - joined the trip. What did you think of that?
MOOLENAAR: Well, one of the reasons we're ahead in AI is because of the innovation of companies like Nvidia, and I think that's important to keep that lead. To do that, I believe we need to have the capability for export controls that allow China to improve incrementally but not exponentially. We don't want them to catch up and move ahead of us in the AI race because, ultimately, that will benefit their military capabilities, and we don't want to see a more aggressive China when it comes to the South China Sea and our interests around the world.
INSKEEP: The president has sometimes approved chip sales to China and talked about doing more. Are you sure he's on the same page with you on this?
MOOLENAAR: Well, I think it's a matter of degree. You know, I've argued for what we call a rolling technical threshold and legislation that would say, basically, we can sell to China - not our best technologies and not technologies that will enable them to enhance their capabilities significantly. We want them to use American technology. We just don't want them to catch up. And what we've seen in other industries, whether it's drones - they'd like to do this in automotive. They've done it in rare earths and critical minerals. We've seen them gain the technology, scale the technology and then use unfair trade practices and drive American businesses out of business, which affects our workforce in the United States.
INSKEEP: Well, let me ask you about one other aspect of this. There is much talk of China offering greater investment in the United States. You've been a skeptic of that as well, although, the president has loved announcements from other countries that they are investing in the United States. What advice would you give President Trump on that?
MOOLENAAR: My hope is that we will continue to work with like-minded allies. You know, we're in the 250th anniversary of our Declaration of Independence, where we celebrate, endowed by our creator with rights, and the government's job is to basically enforce those rights and human dignity. China is very different in that regard, where the government basically dictates to the people what they can and can't do. And so I think it's important that we partner with like-minded allies investing in this country, building those relationships and continue to have a trade relationship with China but recognize they have a very different world view and actually are undermining our interests around the world.
INSKEEP: Does that mean you don't want China's money, at least not as an ownership stake in the United States?
MOOLENAAR: I think it's important that we maintain our lead. We maintain the control of our own destiny. And we've seen, like in the rare earth elements and different critical minerals, where they're willing to leverage whatever advantage they have for their own political agenda, and we don't want to be vulnerable. We want our supply chains to be resilient, not dependent on China. So whether it's critical minerals, whether it's medicines, we want the United States to have that supply chain resilience.
INSKEEP: Representative John Moolenaar. Thanks so much.
MOOLENAAR: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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